Re: Banter Thread 5.0

[GreyBeard]

@Grselig, what you say makes sense, but the Princeton professor more or less has a view that the oceans are rising at an unprecedented rate, so much so that by 2050 many places on earth will be in trouble. Click on the link in my post above and watch the video, it was pretty interesting.

[sroc4]

I totally agree with you guys,but the statement that was made by the Princeton geoscience professor that in 30 yrs. what used to be a 100 year flood will be happening every year instead of every 100 yrs. is what really raised my eyebrows. I agree with your rationalization that there were drastic changes to the earth over the course of thousands of years, but his point was that this drastic change is going to happen within 30 yrs. not 30,000.

They said that 20 yrs ago too.  Al Gore at the turn of the century and his scientists also said that the Greenland ice sheet will be gone along with most of western Antarctica and the sea level was going to rise close to 20 feet and many coastal cities could have been under water already if we didnt do something to slow our CO2 gas emissions.  Well guess what, our CO2 is higher than ever before and yet the greenland ice sheet is actually at record levels in some spots and Antarctica has set records as well.  In fact the CO2 levels are almost twice as high as they have ever been recorded in over 400,000 years.  Yet riddle me this.  Why is it then if there is a direct correlation between human CO2 emissions and global temperature that the global temperature has been hotter 4 times in the recorded history.  This isnt made up.  This is fact based on the data available to us.
Wouldnt one expect that the temps should be increasing in a 1:1 relationship?  Also, why is it that the current global warming seems to be in a pause?  If anything the data suggests the temps are actually cooler, although still well above normal anomalies.  Why would the temps be paused or even cooling a little if the C02 level conts to rise what seems almost exponentially?  Here is a graph that shows the last 400,000+yrs with Temp anomalies in red on the left side, measured CO2 levels in Blue on the right, and time in yrs horizontally.  I have circled the CO2 level.  



Data Sources for CO2: Vostok ice core, Law Dome ice core, and Mauna Loa air samples.

Data Source for Temperature: Vostok ice core.


You dont have to be a Princeton scientist to see that there is somewhat of a pattern here of warming and cooling.  Up until us silly humans started the industrial revolution one can clearly see that up until recently temp and CO2 seemed to correlate quite nicely actually.  But all of a sudden this arrogant species called humans triggered a surge of CO2 in the atmosphere to levels apparently unprecedented, yet looking at this graph, why then did the temps did not increase in a similar fashion.  Now dont get me wrong here we are a contributor to the input and we play a role, but could there be another player even bigger than man made climate change driving a cyclical pattern on planet earth that occurs on orders of magnitude much bigger than most of us can grasp?  Could it be based on the trends of the past that in the not so distant future, 20-50-maybe 100 or so years from now the cycle will shift back again to the colder phases of the earth?  Like someone did back in the day when the consensus was that the earth was flat or when earth was the center of the universe, cant we at least question the idea that it is a foregone conclusion that us silly humans have whats driving the changing climate all figured out, done/finished?  

With such large time scales what could possibly be driving it then.  Well how about the sun and the cosmos.  Climate change:  The simplified equation should look like this right?:

natural variability + man made contribution = climate change

But what if you got one part of that equation is wrong?  That would make the answer wrong wouldnt it?  Up until this past year solar forcing has not been included in that equation.  But that is changing, and so too will the consensus as more and more scientists start including solar forcing , and the global electric circuit into the Natural variability part of the equation.  This isnt made up cockca.  This is a fact.  It just doesnt get the same mainstream media attention.  Live long enough and we will see a shift in the current "consensus".  Heck there is known documented climate change also occuring on Satturn, Jupiter, and venus.  Only something on a grand scale can cause that on multiple planets.

[bobjohnsonforthehall]

Greybeard...
I would say that this is a good lesson for you. Being a professor from Princeton does not make someone who wants to push a narrative any less full of crap when he or she opens his or her mouth.

Ten years ago Glacier National Park put up signs that by 2020 the glaciers would no longer be there because of global warming (or climate change or whatever). Those signs have quietly been removed as the glaciers remain. If I had a dime for every climate doomsday prediction that hasn't ended up happening...I'd have a s***load of dimes.

[CPcantmeasuresnow]

I totally agree with you guys,but the statement that was made by the Princeton geoscience professor that in 30 yrs. what used to be a 100 year flood will be happening every year instead of every 100 yrs. is what really raised my eyebrows. I agree with your rationalization that there were drastic changes to the earth over the course of thousands of years, but his point was that this drastic change is going to happen within 30 yrs. not 30,000.

They said that 20 yrs ago too.  Al Gore at the turn of the century and his scientists also said that the Greenland ice sheet will be gone along with most of western Antarctica and the sea level was going to rise close to 20 feet and many coastal cities could have been under water already if we didnt do something to slow our CO2 gas emissions.  Well guess what, our CO2 is higher than ever before and yet the greenland ice sheet is actually at record levels in some spots and Antarctica has set records as well.  In fact the CO2 levels are almost twice as high as they have ever been recorded in over 400,000 years.  Yet riddle me this.  Why is it then if there is a direct correlation between human CO2 emissions and global temperature that the global temperature has been hotter 4 times in the recorded history.  This isnt made up.  This is fact based on the data available to us.
Wouldnt one expect that the temps should be increasing in a 1:1 relationship?  Also, why is it that the current global warming seems to be in a pause?  If anything the data suggests the temps are actually cooler, although still well above normal anomalies.  Why would the temps be paused or even cooling a little if the C02 level conts to rise what seems almost exponentially?  Here is a graph that shows the last 400,000+yrs with Temp anomalies in red on the left side, measured CO2 levels in Blue on the right, and time in yrs horizontally.  I have circled the CO2 level.  



Data Sources for CO2: Vostok ice core, Law Dome ice core, and Mauna Loa air samples.

Data Source for Temperature: Vostok ice core.


You dont have to be a Princeton scientist to see that there is somewhat of a pattern here of warming and cooling.  Up until us silly humans started the industrial revolution one can clearly see that up until recently temp and CO2 seemed to correlate quite nicely actually.  But all of a sudden this arrogant species called humans triggered a surge of CO2 in the atmosphere to levels apparently unprecedented, yet looking at this graph, why then did the temps did not increase in a similar fashion.  Now dont get me wrong here we are a contributor to the input and we play a role, but could there be another player even bigger than man made climate change driving a cyclical pattern on planet earth that occurs on orders of magnitude much bigger than most of us can grasp?  Could it be based on the trends of the past that in the not so distant future, 20-50-maybe 100 or so years from now the cycle will shift back again to the colder phases of the earth?  Like someone did back in the day when the consensus was that the earth was flat or when earth was the center of the universe, cant we at least question the idea that it is a foregone conclusion that us silly humans have whats driving the changing climate all figured out, done/finished?  

With such large time scales what could possibly be driving it then.  Well how about the sun and the cosmos.  Climate change:  The simplified equation should look like this right?:

natural variability + man made contribution = climate change

But what if you got one part of that equation is wrong?  That would make the answer wrong wouldnt it?  Up until this past year solar forcing has not been included in that equation.  But that is changing, and so too will the consensus as more and more scientists start including solar forcing , and the global electric circuit into the Natural variability part of the equation.  This isnt made up cockca.  This is a fact.  It just doesnt get the same mainstream media attention.  Live long enough and we will see a shift in the current "consensus".  Heck there is known documented climate change also occuring on Satturn, Jupiter, and venus.  Only something on a grand scale can cause that on multiple planets.

This needs to be on a new page so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, and that's what I did.

[GreyBeard]

bobjohnson,I never said that I agreed with the professor's views,I just wanted to see the consensus among some of our esteemed forum members.
I had the privilege of camping out in Glacier Park way back in June 1974. Spectacular place. Walls of snow 30' high on the sides of Going-to-the -Sun road. Unbelievable views of the Rockies, even more so after we later crossed into Canada into Vancouver up to Lake Louise. It was part a 6 week cross country road trip that myself and 2 buddies made that summer after graduating college.Good memories.

sroc-you always have a great analytical perspective and did not disappoint. I remember that whole Al Gore fiasco. Didn't he also claim to have invented the internet?lol.

[amugs]

CP and Doc excellent posts.
Al Gore said west never see snow again, the glaciers and Antarctica and Arctic Ice shelves woul disappear.
CP beautifully and factually stated there is something much bigger that us arrogant, pompous, hu-mans who think we can save, solve and satisfy the why of things we have NO control over. The galactical electroverse, magnetic pole shift, cosmic plasma sheet, sun which if you did not know affects everything on this planet and us.
@SROC I follow Adapt 2030, Suspicious Observer, Oppenheimer Ranch Project and Yanamassa Ranch who have incredible factual videos just on this and other aspects.
Anyway, we were much warmer in the medieval warm period before the Dalton and Maunder Mimimums. We will again be warmer and we will again be colder. The ebb and flow of this fluid to rock, spaceship that is floating in the cosmos.

[bobjohnsonforthehall]

Understood. I guess your constantly referring to his being a Princeton professor threw me off, leading me to think that his title should somehow give more gravitas to his words. No worries. And for the record I think that everyone should constantly look for new ideas that could possibly dissuade from ones hardened beliefs, so it is always useful to watch things like this, in case there truly is something that can be learned.

Just in the case of this video...not so much unfortunately.

[amugs]

This is unbelievable as to the teenage crusader for saving the planet. A complete farce.
https://theduran.com/facebook-glitch-reveals-greta-thunburgs-father-posting-as-teenage-climate-activist/

[amugs]

Prince eton and most of the Ivy's and college profs drink this poison so they may get funding for their projects. The cycle of college research projects that profs rely on

[sroc4]

I totally agree with you guys,but the statement that was made by the Princeton geoscience professor that in 30 yrs. what used to be a 100 year flood will be happening every year instead of every 100 yrs. is what really raised my eyebrows. I agree with your rationalization that there were drastic changes to the earth over the course of thousands of years, but his point was that this drastic change is going to happen within 30 yrs. not 30,000.

They said that 20 yrs ago too.  Al Gore at the turn of the century and his scientists also said that the Greenland ice sheet will be gone along with most of western Antarctica and the sea level was going to rise close to 20 feet and many coastal cities could have been under water already if we didnt do something to slow our CO2 gas emissions.  Well guess what, our CO2 is higher than ever before and yet the greenland ice sheet is actually at record levels in some spots and Antarctica has set records as well.  In fact the CO2 levels are almost twice as high as they have ever been recorded in over 400,000 years.  Yet riddle me this.  Why is it then if there is a direct correlation between human CO2 emissions and global temperature that the global temperature has been hotter 4 times in the recorded history.  This isnt made up.  This is fact based on the data available to us.
Wouldnt one expect that the temps should be increasing in a 1:1 relationship?  Also, why is it that the current global warming seems to be in a pause?  If anything the data suggests the temps are actually cooler, although still well above normal anomalies.  Why would the temps be paused or even cooling a little if the C02 level conts to rise what seems almost exponentially?  Here is a graph that shows the last 400,000+yrs with Temp anomalies in red on the left side, measured CO2 levels in Blue on the right, and time in yrs horizontally.  I have circled the CO2 level.  



Data Sources for CO2: Vostok ice core, Law Dome ice core, and Mauna Loa air samples.

Data Source for Temperature: Vostok ice core.


You dont have to be a Princeton scientist to see that there is somewhat of a pattern here of warming and cooling.  Up until us silly humans started the industrial revolution one can clearly see that up until recently temp and CO2 seemed to correlate quite nicely actually.  But all of a sudden this arrogant species called humans triggered a surge of CO2 in the atmosphere to levels apparently unprecedented, yet looking at this graph, why then did the temps did not increase in a similar fashion.  Now dont get me wrong here we are a contributor to the input and we play a role, but could there be another player even bigger than man made climate change driving a cyclical pattern on planet earth that occurs on orders of magnitude much bigger than most of us can grasp?  Could it be based on the trends of the past that in the not so distant future, 20-50-maybe 100 or so years from now the cycle will shift back again to the colder phases of the earth?  Like someone did back in the day when the consensus was that the earth was flat or when earth was the center of the universe, cant we at least question the idea that it is a foregone conclusion that us silly humans have whats driving the changing climate all figured out, done/finished?  

With such large time scales what could possibly be driving it then.  Well how about the sun and the cosmos.  Climate change:  The simplified equation should look like this right?:

natural variability + man made contribution = climate change

But what if you got one part of that equation is wrong?  That would make the answer wrong wouldnt it?  Up until this past year solar forcing has not been included in that equation.  But that is changing, and so too will the consensus as more and more scientists start including solar forcing , and the global electric circuit into the Natural variability part of the equation.  This isnt made up cockca.  This is a fact.  It just doesnt get the same mainstream media attention.  Live long enough and we will see a shift in the current "consensus".  Heck there is known documented climate change also occuring on Satturn, Jupiter, and venus.  Only something on a grand scale can cause that on multiple planets.

This needs to be on a new page so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, and that's what I did.

Thanks CP. Where did you put it?

[SENJsnowman]

This needs to be on a new page so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, and that's what I did.

Thanks CP. Where did you put it?

I'm thinking CP meant that by reposting it on a brand new page 20, he essentially 'pinned' it to the top of the latest page so everyone has to scroll by it and see it as they post in banter. At least that was my interpretation.

[CPcantmeasuresnow]

I totally agree with you guys,but the statement that was made by the Princeton geoscience professor that in 30 yrs. what used to be a 100 year flood will be happening every year instead of every 100 yrs. is what really raised my eyebrows. I agree with your rationalization that there were drastic changes to the earth over the course of thousands of years, but his point was that this drastic change is going to happen within 30 yrs. not 30,000.

They said that 20 yrs ago too.  Al Gore at the turn of the century and his scientists also said that the Greenland ice sheet will be gone along with most of western Antarctica and the sea level was going to rise close to 20 feet and many coastal cities could have been under water already if we didnt do something to slow our CO2 gas emissions.  Well guess what, our CO2 is higher than ever before and yet the greenland ice sheet is actually at record levels in some spots and Antarctica has set records as well.  In fact the CO2 levels are almost twice as high as they have ever been recorded in over 400,000 years.  Yet riddle me this.  Why is it then if there is a direct correlation between human CO2 emissions and global temperature that the global temperature has been hotter 4 times in the recorded history.  This isnt made up.  This is fact based on the data available to us.
Wouldnt one expect that the temps should be increasing in a 1:1 relationship?  Also, why is it that the current global warming seems to be in a pause?  If anything the data suggests the temps are actually cooler, although still well above normal anomalies.  Why would the temps be paused or even cooling a little if the C02 level conts to rise what seems almost exponentially?  Here is a graph that shows the last 400,000+yrs with Temp anomalies in red on the left side, measured CO2 levels in Blue on the right, and time in yrs horizontally.  I have circled the CO2 level.  



Data Sources for CO2: Vostok ice core, Law Dome ice core, and Mauna Loa air samples.

Data Source for Temperature: Vostok ice core.


You dont have to be a Princeton scientist to see that there is somewhat of a pattern here of warming and cooling.  Up until us silly humans started the industrial revolution one can clearly see that up until recently temp and CO2 seemed to correlate quite nicely actually.  But all of a sudden this arrogant species called humans triggered a surge of CO2 in the atmosphere to levels apparently unprecedented, yet looking at this graph, why then did the temps did not increase in a similar fashion.  Now dont get me wrong here we are a contributor to the input and we play a role, but could there be another player even bigger than man made climate change driving a cyclical pattern on planet earth that occurs on orders of magnitude much bigger than most of us can grasp?  Could it be based on the trends of the past that in the not so distant future, 20-50-maybe 100 or so years from now the cycle will shift back again to the colder phases of the earth?  Like someone did back in the day when the consensus was that the earth was flat or when earth was the center of the universe, cant we at least question the idea that it is a foregone conclusion that us silly humans have whats driving the changing climate all figured out, done/finished?  

With such large time scales what could possibly be driving it then.  Well how about the sun and the cosmos.  Climate change:  The simplified equation should look like this right?:

natural variability + man made contribution = climate change

But what if you got one part of that equation is wrong?  That would make the answer wrong wouldnt it?  Up until this past year solar forcing has not been included in that equation.  But that is changing, and so too will the consensus as more and more scientists start including solar forcing , and the global electric circuit into the Natural variability part of the equation.  This isnt made up cockca.  This is a fact.  It just doesnt get the same mainstream media attention.  Live long enough and we will see a shift in the current "consensus".  Heck there is known documented climate change also occuring on Satturn, Jupiter, and venus.  Only something on a grand scale can cause that on multiple planets.

This needs to be on a new page so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, and that's what I did.

Thanks CP. Where did you put it?

I only replied to your post so it didn't get stuck on the bottom of the last page where all great posts go to die. I liked what you posted Doc, even though I'm still 50-50 on this whole argument.

[docstox12]

Prince eton and most of the Ivy's and college profs drink this poison so they may get funding for their projects. The cycle of college research projects that profs rely on

Mugs, whenever I hear any Ivy Tower intellectual speak, I remember what Napolean Bonaparte once said...."you don't reason with intellectuals, you shoot them"! Myself, I would do it with a reasoned argument like Doc did, not literally.But when I hear the jibberish coming from collage professors these days, I have a hard time not favoring the literal!

[amugs]

For Weenie purposes Saturday afternoon and night

[Frank_Wx]

FYI

https://www.njstrongweatherforum.com/t1006-winter-meet-up#152326

[jmanley32]

Hey all, just thought I might get some support from my njwx fam. I have yet again developed a even larger kidney stone of 6mm ( I actually used the calculator I use for snow lmao), yes do the conversion almost a 1/4 inch!! Owwwwww.....Anyways it isn't blocking so its not severe pain but the chances of passing it naturally are 20% so I opted to have a lithotripsy again set for Monday, which literally means stone crusher. Sends shockwaves through the body and breaks the stone into hopefully sand size pieces that can easily pass.  A in and out procedure but you are still put under which I hate as theres always risk with it and I have gone under many many times in my life so far.  SO I am actually glad the get together is postponed cuz I would be no fun and probably wouldn't come anyways its not comfortable feeling this way plus I do not think I can drink any alcohol 48 hrs before the procedure.  So hoping all goes well, then we have to figure out why I obviously have a recurring kidney stone problem now, the first they hoped was just random but this is only 6 and a half months after the last one. So its a concern that many more could come.  And I cannot continue a lifestyle like this, it really effects the whole body, slows you down intermittant pain...it sucks.

[jmanley32]

For Weenie purposes Saturday afternoon and night

2 inches maybe imby, woopeee.....

[docstox12]

Hey all, just thought I might get some support from my njwx fam. I have yet again developed a even larger kidney stone of 6mm ( I actually used the calculator I use for snow lmao), yes do the conversion almost a 1/4 inch!! Owwwwww.....Anyways it isn't blocking so its not severe pain but the chances of passing it naturally are 20% so I opted to have a lithotripsy again set for Monday, which literally means stone crusher. Sends shockwaves through the body and breaks the stone into hopefully sand size pieces that can easily pass.  A in and out procedure but you are still put under which I hate as theres always risk with it and I have gone under many many times in my life so far.  SO I am actually glad the get together is postponed cuz I would be no fun and probably wouldn't come anyways its not comfortable feeling this way plus I do not think I can drink any alcohol 48 hrs before the procedure.  So hoping all goes well, then we have to figure out why I obviously have a recurring kidney stone problem now, the first they hoped was just random but this is only 6 and a half months after the last one. So its a concern that many more could come.  And I cannot continue a lifestyle like this, it really effects the whole body, slows you down intermittant pain...it sucks.

Hey, JMan, sorry to hear about that.I know what chronic pain is like, have been living with arthritic knee pain for 8 years but can't do replacements as I am the primary caregiver for my 99 year old Mom and you are flat on your arse for 6 weeks after replacements..Maybe there is something in your diet that is causing those stones.maybe drink a lot more water to flush them out? You are way too young to be having this kind of crap, that's for old timers like me,I'll be 70 this year.Anyway, hope the procedure goes well and you and your Dpctor can get to the cause of the stones and try to stop them from forming.God Bless!

[jmanley32]

Actually doc kidney stones can be a issue at any age. Or gall stones. My wife had kidney stone issue in her 20s. Water is good but we want to prevent them. I may have a diet too high in oxelates. We have to do a lot metabolic bloodwork after I'm better.

[frank 638]

Jman I am sorry for what you are going through and I hope you are feeling better.i had kidney stone about 4 years ago the pain I went through is not a joke for me it started from my stomach to my lower hip I couldn’t stand or sit I got rushed to the hospital they gave me pain relief just calm me down but it didn’t help when I pissed out my god that was the worst pain ever .now I don’t have them anymore for about 2 years I was on med and they would give me a Ultrasound test .the best way to avoid Kidney stones is to drink about 6 to 10 cups of water a day try to stay away from gatorade Sodas and sweet feel better bud

[frank 638]

One more thing jman try to drink lemon with water and eat and yogurt I have been doing this everyday and it helps

[Frank_Wx]

Winter cancel?

[amugs]

Isotherm says Feb best month for us for winter. We shall see.

[weatherwatchermom]

Isotherm says Feb best month for us for winter. We shall see.

I really hope so!!

[amugs]

Isotherm says Feb best month for us for winter. We shall see.

I really hope so!!

Me too Mom!!

[heehaw453]

Been so much talk of doom and gloom on the upcoming pattern, I'm wondering if I've seen my last snow of this anemic season.

[billg315]

Been so much talk of doom and gloom on the upcoming pattern, I'm wondering if I've seen my last snow of this anemic season.

It has definitely been a lackluster winter at best. But I remember two years ago was like that and we got slammed with snow from March into April. So I wouldn’t bet on this being our last snow. March is funny like that: it seems in March you can get snow if it’s a good winter or bad winter; it’s just a wildcard.

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